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Running a successful bison ranch takes more than land and a dream. Jon Sepp, one of the founders of Roam Free Ranch, will agree. Jon knew from childhood that bison ranching was in his future. After 10 years in the military, he transitioned to ranch life in Montana.
But it wasn’t until meeting Brittany Masters, the other half of the Roam Free team, that pieces of the puzzle began to fall into place. Brittany was ready to escape the grind of the corporate world, and she brought her marketing talents to Roam Free.
Together they were able to bring high-quality bison products to market and communicate their mission to consumers. You can even find their products in most Costcos now!
During this episode, Jon and Brittany fill us in on the unique challenges that come with bison ranching in Montana, along with the successes they’ve had in their journey.
We also chat about:
- Jon’s time in the military
- How Roam Free was started
- Brittany’s story
- The importance of branding and marketing
- The greatness of Costco
- Roam Free product offerings
- Idealizing farm life
- What’s next for Roam Free
Rather watch this episode on YouTube? Check it out here: Episode 261: Roam Free Ranch
Connect with Roam Free:
Website: Roam Free Ranch
Instagram: @goroamfree
Facebook: Roam Free Ranch
Episode Credits:
Thank you to all who’ve made this show possible. Our hosts are Diana Rodgers and James Connolly. Our producer is Emily Soape. And, of course, we are grateful for our sponsors, Global Food Justice Alliance members, and listeners.
If you believe in making sure that people all over the world should have access to nutritious food, please join my mission through my non-profit, the Global Food Justice Alliance. All sustaining members get early access to ad-free podcasts plus free downloads, and you’ll be helping get healthy protein like meat, fish, and eggs to food-insecure kids. That’s sustainabledish.com/join.
Transcript:
Diana Rodgers, RD
Welcome to the Sustainable Dish Podcast. I’m Diana Rodgers, a real food registered dietitian, author, and sustainability advocate. I co-host this podcast with James Connolly, who was a producer on my film Sacred Cow. I also founded the Global Food Justice Alliance, an initiative advocating for the inclusion of animal-source foods like meat, dairy, and eggs for a more nutritious, sustainable, and equitable worldwide food system. You can check it out and join me at global food justice.org. Thanks again for listening. And now, on to our show.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Welcome to the podcast, everyone. I am so happy to finally have Jon and Brittany here from Roam Free Bison. They were so kind to host Anson and I several years ago at this point at their ranch and we went out there with the intent to help them build some fencing. And then like I think after 20 minutes, we were like, ‘Yeah, we’re good.’ Because it is no joke really hard work. So I wanted to have you guys on to talk about your background, the cool stuff that you guys are up to and other interesting stories from where you are out in kind of the middle of nowhere Montana. So I don’t know how you want to start with, you know, introducing your backgrounds and everything. But I’ll just kind of hand it over to you guys.
Brittany Masters
Okay, yeah. Jon, do you want to start with your background? It is much more interesting than mine.
Jon Sepp
Sure. So I started the ranch before I met Brittany. And in the end of 2013. I had spent 10 years in the military before that, but I knew I was going to transition out and and raise bison.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Wait, you covered that too quickly, though. You weren’t just in the military. Yeah. Can you explain what you did in the military?
Jon Sepp
I spent most of my time commanding a SEER unit and testing parachutes like freefall parachutes, related equipment, approving that. And that was all for different sister services and agencies. That was my main core function – was doing that skydiving a lot and making sure stuff worked and was safe. So that’s what I did a majority of my time.
Diana Rodgers, RD
And you have the scars to prove it.
Jon Sepp
I do. Yeah. In fact, most of my scars were actually, prior to that job. That’s how I ended in that job was personally I did a lot of jumping and was injured doing that which led me to this job. But that’s a story for another day
Brittany Masters
A prerequisite on becoming a free fall parachute.
Jon Sepp
Yeah, it’s a volunteer-only job when in the military. And I mean, not anybody’s just going to you. They don’t just assign you to that. So it was just a natural transition from what I was already interested in and doing.
Diana Rodgers, RD
For someone who just seriously has almost a death wish, I guess, I suppose. I mean, that is what is it?
Jon Sepp
Yeah. It was a really good job. I loved it. It was really meaningful. Everything that I did, I felt like it mattered and made a difference and saved lives. I loved doing that. And that was a rewarding part of the job. And you got to have fun doing that. I mean, it was like the best of all, jobs you could possibly have. You know, like…
Brittany Masters
Besides bison ranching.
Jon Sepp
Yeah. Besides Bison Ranching, but Yep. During I had known since I was well before I joined the military since I was young. But when I grew up, I had always wanted to have bison. And so even during that time, when I was in the military, I was saving, preparing, I took side jobs on the weekends for years. And then, 10 years ago, transition out into bison ranching. And…
Diana Rodgers, RD
Okay, I’m ready for that phase now. So you built the house that you guys are, are sitting in right now. Yep, we sure did.
Jon Sepp
Yep. We sure did. I built this. And we fillmed this really hilarious TV show doing that, that helps get the start, I guess a little bit. When I first moved to Montana, all I can afford where we’re at now, prior to meeting Brittany, and just leaving the military was 240 acres. That sounds like a lot, but it’s not that’s like small time ranching, you’re never going to make that… that’s never going to pay your bills here in Montana. Maybe if it’s irrigated, but even then probably not for the cost that you’re going to pay for it. So you need to survive. Out here you need bulk land, bulk animals, bulk pricing, you know, your margins are thin, it’s like running an airline So, but it was a good foray and entry into where we’re at now, which is you know, we’ve grown significantly. We’ve been all sorts of different things through leases more owned land, less owned land, you know, learned… learn just a whole bunch about that part of the process, which is just as difficult as wrenching the bison let alone than bringing the goods to market. Right. You know, there’s a big chain in there of events that has to happen to get that meat to people. So…
Diana Rodgers, RD
Yeah, and you guys have done such an amazing job. I mean, you’re not only like a handy guy that can build this home and like, you both, you know, have to be bear aware, when you’re out there, you know, making sure that you’re prepared for that when you’re like building fencing, and then you have to know about regenerative grazing, which is what you’re doing there. But then you also have to have that marketing skill in a business sense. And that’s just a really rare combination of things that I don’t run into that often. I mean, a lot of people I guess, on my podcast, end up having all those skills, but it is a unique set.
Brittany Masters
Yep. Oh, no doubt and meeting Brittany. I mean, massively. Obviously, I don’t want to tell your story for you. But that’s the marketing component that I could never, you know, like any idiot can get out there and pound a fence post, but to really communicate what you’re doing in an effective way to make the consumer aware to make better and different choices. That’s really, really the hard part. It’s the outlet. It’s the very end that there is a ton of effort and work and danger that leads up to that. But the hardest part of the whole process is just translating the animal from the herd to the store. And that’s obviously what Brittany has done very well.
Brittany Masters
Together. Not a one man show, that’s for sure. Yeah.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Yeah. So talk about like how you started. So you built this house, you’ve got 240 acres and walk through no timeframe and the growth that you’ve done since then?
Jon Sepp
Yep. So that was the very end of 2013. I started, I just found a piece out here. I live we live within the Flathead Reservation. So we’re within the Confederated Salish and Kootenai Tribes nation here, however, it’s considered an open reservation. So there are plots of land that were homesteaded prior to it becoming reservation, that’s what we operate on. And so there’s a strange mixture of some laws and things that you know, have to deal with extra here on top of, there’s greater barriers to entry here. And I would say, the barriers to entry are not monetary, which we were looking for. How do you get in? How do you find a way to afford this? Because it’s so cash intensive. Are you willing to put up with a lot of other headaches and insulating factors that outside people that are trying to make a start would not want to? And that’s…
Brittany Masters
Translation – where can we afford lands?
Jon Sepp
Yeah. Where can you afford land? Now, it is a beautiful area. But there are a lot of difficulties to being here. Case in point right now we’ve got three fires all within a mile of of ourselves right now, you know, each about 10,000 acres or more. So there’s… that’s, you know, there’s a constant ever evolving difficulty of where we’re at. But it is extremely good bison country. And, you know, I wish I could say we planned how everything turned out now, but we didn’t, you know, we’ve just kind of work… continued to work our way through it and stay persistent where we’re at to grow the ranch. We’ve been as large as 18,000 acres. And right now we are sitting right around after probably this, I think by this winter, we’ll probably be right around 4000. So and that’s partially owned, partially leased land, and not all land is the same. And that’s actually how we ended in regenerative agriculture and doing what we’re doing now. You know, the end point of doing this is to pay our bills, live a lifestyle, feed people, and do that in a way that’s responsible. And when I first bought my 240 acres here, the most affordable land I could find was on a road called Wilkes Gulch. And if you know, have you ever heard somebody say ‘You dry-gulched me?’
Diana Rodgers, RD
No. I have not heard that phrase before.
Jon Sepp
It used to be a popular catchphrase 100 years ago or more, meaning like you pulled the wool over my eyes, you’ve, you know, you got me. And that term came from people that would sell you land in a dry gulch. And the first land that I bought was probably the most arid, worst land you could buy in Montana. And that was extremely cheap. And I was able to afford it. But that led me into figuring out when I first stocked the land with bison, I bought nine bison and when I very first started 10 years ago, how are we going to make this work? They’ve already eaten everything. What’s a better way to do this? And that led down the path of rotational grazing to Holistic Management to now what we call regenerative and there’s, you know, a million iterations in between. That’s how we’ve gotten so into this. And as we grow and take on new land, that’s better. We continue to implement those policies. For all the reasons above.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Yeah. Gosh, I don’t know which direction to go in next to ask you.
Brittany Masters
You know too much.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Yeah, that’s right. I know too much. It’s almost like… how do I prompt you next? Well, Brittany how did you… how did you get involved with this?
Brittany Masters
Yeah, so I mean, Jon was at the point when I met him where, I mean, I think he was considering walking away from the ranch. I think that’s fair to say, Yeah, where he had done but you know, he says the selling is the hard part. I’m for sure. It’s the branding. That was the hard part. But he had, you know, built his house, fenced it by hand with no machinery, had purchased nine bison had them out here, and was selling cuts of meat to food service, so to restaurants, and yet sold out of all the New York, all the middle meets, all the ribeyes all the tenderloins, and he still had 80% of the animal left to sell, and was just going like, this isn’t gonna work, like how are we going to move all this trim and, you know, gross and things at an equal rate. And that kind of logistically wasn’t working. And so he was doing some fencing work in Seattle area, when I met him, and I was, you know, working a nine to five. I was in marketing, I was really looking for a change. And I thought I would take a sabbatical. And I was telling him when we first met, that I was considering taking a sabbatical to go take out fence in Patagonia. He’s like, I have some fencing. He invited me out to the ranch. And I mean, you’ve been here, you come out over the mountains, and you’re just like, no way we’re selling this place. Like this is… you got to find a way to make it work. And by the way, I mean, Jon would never survive in Seattle. It’s just not his… not his thing. He’d go crazy. And so when I, you know, came over here, obviously, you know, met Jon and we wanted to figure out how to, you know, make it work together. I was in Seattle, he was in Montana, and was just obvious that we were going to choose Montana and try to make a go of it. So…
Diana Rodgers, RD
Yeah, and I met you guys. I mean, you’re also really into all the health stuff that I promote. And I met you at Urban Ancestral Health conference, you guys are sampling your bison, and you are by far the friendliest people that I ran into, while the vendors there. I thought your jerky was incredible. So how did you I mean, it came in all these good flavors. And it was like this really fun packaging. So how did the jerky come about?
Brittany Masters
So I mean, I was obsessed with health. Before meeting Jon, I ate a ton of bison. And I was just kind of like a health, you know, not that thought I knew everything. And so when I met Jon, he’s like, Yeah, I have a Bison Ranch. I was asking… I’m like, how are they raised as grass fed, you know, all this different stuff. And so when he was telling me about what he was doing out here, I was like, you know, the Paleo people would love you, you know, and I’ve always had a dream. In fact, I tried to start a Paleo Food Company in 2014, on my own. And, you know, that didn’t work for various reasons. But I would, I was always interested in sort of this kind of food movement and getting closer and closer to just, you know, more natural ways of raising and growing our food. So I just connected that it was like immediate, like connection. Like, of course, we’ve got it, you know, we’ve got to tell everybody about what you’re doing, put a pretty package together and get it to market. And so jerky was logistically, the best way to go forward with that,
Jon Sepp
Yeah. And Brittany worked in brand marketing for 10 years, I mean, she was… not to downplay this, she was a executive at Boeing doing major high level branding for them. So that’s a huge component of… a lot of people think, you know, it’s a logo or a package or whatever it’s not. It’s how… it’s a whole concept of, you know, taking an idea, elevating that and putting that in front of a consumer in the quickest, best way possible. It’s a total science and an art and takes that it takes a lifetime to figure that out. And it’s constantly evolving and shifting. So that’s what Brittany brought to the table as well. She was doing that full time for Boeing. And within three months of meeting, she decided to quit that job, a good paying, great job with benefits in a comfortable, cool area. And come out here, and that’s yes, we took a step back for about a year. I stopped selling meat entirely. And we basically worked on our branding, to discuss how we’re going to best communicate what is it we’re doing, and even, you know, even to this day, we still don’t have cell phone reception out here. We didn’t have internet at the time. It’s really hard to communicate to a consumer when you’re so far away.
Brittany Masters
We had to get internet.
Jon Sepp
Not just with a product but also why they should choose that product, why it’s better for them, why what you’re doing is going to be better and deserves a different price point.
Diana Rodgers, RD
So, yeah, so when I met you guys, you had this really cool RV that you were kind of like you… We’re going to all these different markets. And that’s how you transported Anson and I from, you know the time that we came out, I was at Montana State doing the ancestral health symposium in Bozeman. And we drove out with you guys in this like super cool RV and we’re like eating bison jerky on the way back and then we get out there and you’ve grown so much since then. I mean, the fencing is no joke, as I mentioned Anson and I think we lasted 15 maybe 20 minutes.
Brittany Masters
Oh no. A full day.
Diana Rodgers, RD
No way.
Jon Sepp
I remember Anson got stung by a hornet up there.
Brittany Masters
Yeah, like several hornets. Yeah.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Yeah. And you have to be… so the bear thing. I don’t know. I have this like huge fear of bears. And you mentioned to me that across the street from your home is… Can you? I won’t do it justice. But will you mentioned like the situation?
Jon Sepp
Oh, well, now we have I mean, on even our newest ranch out here, our home all the old ranches, we… it’s a new thing, typically, where we live in western Montana, we’re just south of Glacier. But there weren’t Grizzlies here for at least 100 years. It’s been a new thing that they’ve wandered this direction/some of it’s been reintroduction. However it happened. There’s, you know, normally we were just dealing with black bears, which are totally harmless. Now we have quite a few grizzlies, and some that even live on the property, den up in the winter. They’re just learning to live and deal with that. But yes, they’re all close by. They’re trying to figure out their new ground out here to what to eat, where to eat, where all the people are, where the water is, where the animals are. And so it’s just an interesting watching and learning that process being around. But yeah, definitely something to watch out for. You know, inland bears are not like Alaska bears that are eating fish all day. Inland bears are there to hunt animals right to and when the berries run out, they get hungry before winter. And so yeah, it’s definitely it presents a unique challenge of trying to live in the area and with nature, but protect yourself at the same time. So all the hands on the ranch, you know, we’re aware. We have all sorts of different methods and procedures and all that. But yeah, it’s just it’s definitely part of dealing with what we got.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Well, I think I remember you saying that. There was one specific hill where the bad bears like the naughty bears that were like, terrorizing folks who lived, you know, in towns, the state comes and takes them and puts them, relocates them near you.
Jon Sepp
Yes, they come out of the national parks. Yeah, they have trouble bears. And there’s a deal where there is a wilderness area close by, and there is some type of money thing that happens with the government, of course, that somebody gets paid somewhere to take these trouble bears. And rather than terminating them in the park, they’ll relocate them down to some area over here. And I think that’s where a lot of the bears came from. So they already came with bad habits and behaviors to begin with. And those bears coming over. Yeah, I mean, they’ll break in anything, your car, your trailer, your house, whatever it may be. They’re not afraid of people, you know, we’ve noticed all these traits that make them extra difficult to be around. So…
Diana Rodgers, RD
Hmm, yeah. So give us a snapshot of a day, like, how many animals we have, and like how you’ve grown with the different products and kind of where you’re at with all that, because it’s really exciting to me.
Jon Sepp
Yeah. So we launched after Brittany and I met we launched our jerky brand in 2017. It was four flavors. And it was just a natural product, it was really just bison meat and spices which at that time in 2017 to find a sugar free just bison meat and spices without like a bunch of pork fat mixed in and other garbage was really hard to find. And we felt like that was novel. And it was at the time it you can find plenty of that now but that’s really what launched us and elevated us. We got a number of different grocery accounts. And we stuck with that for a number of years until 2020?
Brittany Masters
2021 is when we launched our ready-to-eat product line. So the reason we did jerky at first because it’s shelf stable for 12 months. So as we’re a small ranch and getting going, you can use any kind of meat. We use, you know, older cows, we use younger bulls, and you could use every cut. So we did that and kind of got our you know, got into the market that way. And then we realized that people really wanted bison but they were kind of afraid, you know how am I going to cook it? What kind of recipes you know it’s a really, really lean meat so you can overcook it easily and so we decided that we would try and kind of pair ourselves up with a couple good chefs and do sous vide recipes that took the guesswork out of preparing lean seasonal meats for people. And we launched a chili in 21, which was our first very exciting product. And it did really well. And we launched it with Costco, which is like, you know, unheard of for a small brand. But Costco sells more bison than any other retailer. And they have that, you know, customer is there. And we had, you know, a great relationship. And we got in and it was a test, you know, so it wasn’t like it was on the shelf, and it’s good to go, it really had to sell. And, you know, Costco wasn’t quite sure. Do people care about regenerative? Do they care about grass-fed? Do they care about bison? And turns out they do. So go for it.
Diana Rodgers, RD
I have to say that chili because I still have some in the freezer, too. You guys sent me a bunch and I make omelets with it. It’s like, but it’s hard to find something that appeals to my tastes that’s like ready to go right out like perfectly seasoned, well salted, like delicious. I don’t have to do anything to it. So it was… I was so psyched.
Brittany Masters
Yeah, so we started with that. And then we went into, you know, whole muscle cuts so that the chili is made from ground bison. And then we went to whole muscle cuts like sirloin and then made a chuck roast product as well. So Chili Colorado is more like whole cube stew. And then fajitas, you know what fajitas are – the two most recent products that we launched, and they did really well, too. So we’re really excited about the opportunity. Chili’s coming back in September. So we’re getting another rotation of that.
Jon Sepp
Yeah, it’s been really encouraging that look, you know, Costco is massive, they are the biggest, there’s nobody bigger in terms of food distribution. And so their consumer base too is a bit of a, you know, it’s a test market in terms of if you do well, it’s going to fit the greater trend of what people are looking for. So it was really encouraging to us to say something that might seem really weird to a lot of consumers not to us on a shelf of seeing like a bison only product not mixed with beef, not cut with pork fat, all this other stuff. Are they going to respond to that? Is that something that I’m interested in buying, and it performed extremely well in all markets. And so now we’ve grown regions in Costco, or pretty much in most of the West, and, you know, set a rotation of products in a set for Costco that they recognize this is something that the consumer does desire, as a whole America as a whole does want that. And, you know, as we were climbing that, you know, you’ve been on this fight forever, of seeing here’s a trend, of vegan, plant based – all this garbage, just give me a break, right? That was like, and Costco, surprisingly, that stuff performed good for a short period, but it wasn’t holding in for the long haul. And so they had a reality check that these are the products that people want. And it was kind of like, it proved the concept without having to shout at people still want meat. They recognize that what’s best for their body. And they don’t just want any meat, they want something that’s better for you, raised better, better for the environment, something that’s going to benefit all lands. And this is kind of the way to have their cake and eat it too. So, I mean, I felt like it was a big win for us, obviously. But just bison as a whole. It’s a massive win. And now we’re to the point where our ranch can’t support all the products that we sell. So we’re still growing every day the ranch as much as we can. But we’re to the point where we’re buying other bison too now.
Diana Rodgers, RD
That’s amazing. And just a little plug for Costco because I love Costco. And you know, for anyone who eats the way we eat, I’ve eaten with you guys. You know, you eat the same way I eat. But Costco has some amazing other stuff too. Like it’s really, really awesome. So when I talk to folks about especially people that don’t like to cook from scratch and don’t want to make their own egg bites in the morning. I mean, like my first cookbook was all about, like how to make egg bites and how to make kind of like quick breakfast but it requires so much planning and prep. But now you can just go get egg bites at Costco. You can get… they have these like, you know, I don’t want to plug chicken necessarily, but they have these like chicken burgers that are actually really, really good. They’ve got some really amazing sausages there. And I love that. I mean, it’s your packaging is really it’s like bright and fun and approachable. And I think that that’s yes, like that’s all Brittany and I think that it’s also like it’s a bit of a gamble too. You test something in a double pack – in a gigantic double pack, right? Like, if I’m going to try something new… I always used to tease my dad because I would go to Costco with him when I was a teenager. And he’d be like, oh, let’s just try this gigantic box of it was cereal at the time or something. I’m like, Well, why would you try something you know, but for so it’s a big, like, kudos to you guys that someone is willing to try something that they’ve never ever seen in another grocery store before. It comes in a pretty large size. Usually, like a double like your chili is in a double pack. The fajitas are in a single, right. They’re like in a, you know, just one box. But I just think it’s so great. I’m so so happy for you guys.
Brittany Masters
Yep, Thank you.
Brittany Masters
Yeah, thank you. I mean, the buyers do their due diligence. Yeah, they put you through the wringer. They’ve tried and tested it.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Do they? Do they just curious about that? Because I’ve never… I’ve fantasized about bringing a product out. But I have, you know, don’t have one. But what’s that like? Like, do they go into stores and sample it? Do they do focus groups? Or is it pretty much their buyers just trying it and like knowing their market and thinking that it’s a good shot?
Jon Sepp
Yeah, that and doing tests. I mean, it’s the individual buyer controls each region, they switch around quite a bit, and they’ll lean on each other. So you know, if something goes well in one region, they can bring it to other regions. So if they see those sales numbers doing well, and not all regions before the same for performing the same, because not all customers are the same. So it’s very, as we’ve learned, complex. It’s really calculated. But what I can tell you at the end of it is we love Costco, too. And the more I’ve learned about it, not just because we’re a vendor, but as a consumer, I love Costco, because having gone through that process, I can see that their buyers are there to truly do two things: one, find the best product for you. They only want the best thing that they can find. If there’s something that’s slightly better, they’re going to take that and then to find the absolute lowest cost that they can in that while also still supporting the vendor. So, you know, you think like, well, sure, everybody would love to do that. But their model is brilliant, and that they don’t take the margin out of the vendor always. They, by signing up with your membership for Costco, that helps pay for the margin. And then they don’t build like opulent Whole Foods, you know, you don’t want to go that’s not like a Vegas experience going into Costco, you’re there to get…
Diana Rodgers, RD
It is for me.
Diana Rodgers, RD
It is for me, it is like Vegas for me to actually like I’m sure Brittany and I could spend a long time together in Costco, chatting about everything and shopping together. But yeah, I get what you’re saying. And I also want to head off, so, you know, I remember, you know, when Mark Sisson sold his company to Kraft, or when the Epic guy sold to General Mills there was… I got a lot of pushback from people saying Oh, smaller is better. So I just want to also just let people know that small doesn’t necessarily mean better. And just because, you know, I don’t want to know that you guys are struggling. And I also think it’s also like, really good that you’re not shipping individual boxes all over the place that you I mean, there’s an efficiency there. And there’s probably a lot less waste a lot less packaging, to do it on the scale that you’re doing it instead of, you know, being a little guys at the farmers market that are just trying to sell your individual know, your farmer kind of thing. I mean, that’s great for someone who has like a relationship with a local farmer. But that’s not the only good way. There’s lots of good ways. And I want to see you guys do as well as you can. And this is a wonderful model.
Jon Sepp
Oh, yeah, thank you. We think so too. And that’s another great point is like part of that vetting process in Costco was tearing apart your packaging, anything excess gets removed – a corner of plastic, interior filling, you don’t need what can be the most recycled, recyclable thing. And you go to Whole Foods. And again, you know, you think that should be their priority. It’s not. It’s totally the opposite. It’s totally crazy packaging to the max, how can you jump off the shelf? Costco, you know, to get in, they ask you to minimize those things. So that was interesting, too. But I agree with you. I think it’s a wonderful model. And, yeah, not everybody has to be at the same spot. We started there. We did all the farmers markets. We did that for, you know, five, six years before being able to move to this. But yes, seeing this, it’s extreme. The best thing about it is now we’re to the point where we’re able to affect regenerative bison ranchers beyond just ourselves. We’re able to support those ranches, stabilizing prices. Costco helps us do that. And so a loan for four contracts, that gives more stability to what’s already a niche meat, and allows that to grow. You know, and people that take more steps forward and buying more land, trying to lease more put in more fencing ourselves included, to be better. So, you’re right, it’s not, you don’t always want to get the smallest thing, I guess you also don’t always want to get the biggest thing either.
Brittany Masters
So this has been like a real journey for me. Like I started with, you know, the Pinterest ideas of like, you know, homestead and being just living off the land. And that was like, quickly gone. For me. I mean, by being out here. I mean, that’s what I kind of mean, when I said, I was like, I thought I knew everything about food. And I was really like, on Jon about all the things we had to do and build my chicken coop. And then you know, the chickens ate more dog food than they did little insects that were running around, and then build this and that. And I quickly realized, you know, specifically for this market, because we don’t… we’re not close to a city. So we don’t have a farm… the farmers market for me, was about an hour and a half, one way drive. So for us, in particular, wasn’t going to be a reality that we could just sell locally and keep it small and be able to pay for the land. I think there’s different situations. I mean, especially if you’ve inherited the land, that might be a possibility for you, shipping direct to consumer. We don’t have a fulfillment center at all, not anywhere close to us. So I was shipping boxes UPS, doing a three-hour round trip to UPS. I mean, half the meat would be spoiled half the like, it wasn’t efficient. And so I’ve, yeah, I’ve had a good reality check.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Well, and yes, as someone who now has children that need to go to college, and looking at the price of college, these days, and also, having lived that life, like I have stood around in farmers markets. I did the whole, you know, homestead thing, that’s how I kind of started, you know, with my Sustainable Dish blog. I want farmers to be able to take vacations, I want them to be able to afford to send their kids to college. And I think that there’s a huge kind of idealization that farmers should be suffering. And it is a very hard, highly skilled business to be able to make something financially sustainable. And that should be a huge goal of any sustainable operation is the finances as well. And so I really, you know, while I still appreciate, you know, the ones that are coming up on my Instagram have the, you know, the cute, you know, backyard chickens and the you know, a woman, you know, doing the homesteading thing. That is an aspiration I see as more of a fantasy now and not like having lived it. I don’t want to go back to that. Like, I want to actually be comfortable. Yeah.
Brittany Masters
Yeah, it’s required. I mean, nobody is going to suffer for that long without, you know, some sort of reward. So I mean, I think if we want open space, if we want food grown in America, food security, if we want, you know, these regional food systems, farmers or ranchers have to make money doing it, it has to be a viable option. And not just because we love it so much and are willing to, you know, to suffer for it. I mean, we did. But there has to be, you know, a reward at the end of that.
Jon Sepp
Yeah, and longevity. And I think eventually, that’ll come like a shift in the mindset of the consumer too, because we noticed that quite a bit. I mean, even just casual conversations, people think, Oh, he’s just out there doing his thing, having a fun day, maybe works a couple hours, and they couldn’t be more wrong, you know, like, it is a service job, don’t get me wrong, and that’s why we’re here. We love serving people, I like doing that it feels satisfying for us. But that doesn’t pay the bills. And so, you know, there has to be some level of scaling in there to make that possible. Yeah. Practical. And it’s good for them to because, you know, we get to preserve, like Brittany said, all this open space. And we’ve seen in the last couple of years in Montana, man, what’s happened, everybody’s moved here, amid COVID, amid watching TV shows they all think we want to be here and you know, they think buying 20 acres or 10 acres or even an acre to that might seem like a lot. And now they’re going to live their ideal dreams, but all of those giant legacy ranches that are getting chopped up in that process. It’s terrifying to see because you can’t really ever reverse that process to go back to finding that economy of scale. So it’s always shrinking and that makes it difficult.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Yeah, totally. Okay, I want to talk about two things I want to talk about, ou know, what you’re launching in September, which I’m really excited to chat about. And then I also want to talk briefly about the other intrigue that, you know, I want to talk about. So, which one do you want to? Which one do you want to go for next?
Jon Sepp
Let’s do intrigue and then… or we can hold ’em to the end. Why don’t we talk about what we’re launching really quick, get that out of the way. And then we can jump into the intrigue part. And I’ve got here… in case people watch this. I don’t even know if people…
Diana Rodgers, RD
Oh yes, I do. I put this up on… Hold it more slowly. Yeah. So we’ve got your chili and the fajitas. Which are I mean, that is just, it’s fun. It’s bright. It’s approachable. So yeah, so you’re mostly the… Costco was not paying me for this. They’re not paying you to do to do this extra marketing. I just really am so happy for you guys. Consider your good friends. And so I’m just like…
Brittany Masters
It just makes me so happy too.
Diana Rodgers, RD
I want people to buy your stuff. So, which regions can people find it in? First of all,
Brittany Masters
So the fajitas and the Chili Colorado, and then our bison chili can be found in San Diego, Phoenix area, most all Arizona locations. Almost all Colorado locations. Albuquerque, Las Vegas, St. George, Utah. And then we… are the original bison chili that you make your omelets with – it’s going to be sold in the Northwest region. So that’s Washington, Oregon, Idaho, Montana, Utah.
Jon Sepp
Parts of Colorado. I think like Northwestern Colorado, Yeah, that’s their regions are separated. So the West Coast.
Brittany Masters
West Coast to Rocky Mountain. Yeah.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Cool. Well, I’m gonna, I’ll harass my Massachusetts and Southern New Hampshire Costcos to run it again.
Brittany Masters
They really do. And this is also not a plug, but they really do read everything. So if you want it in your region, you just have to fill out a comment card and it gets to the buyer. And they do consider it. So it does help. Yeah. And then any retailers that are interested.
Diana Rodgers, RD
All right. Oh. Okay, so let’s talk about September.
Brittany Masters
Yeah. September, what do you mean?
Jon Sepp
The launch of our next product.
Brittany Masters
Oh, bison chili.
Jon Sepp
Yeah, so we had a… we had the bison chili, which you had, which was with beans. Now as you know, as we travel across the United States, some people prefer chili with beans, some prefer without beans, we originally wanted to make it without beans. But during the test, we kind of got locked into this where we had to be economical. So we used beans. We are very proud and happy to say we have developed a meat chili which will be coming out this September. So that will be available in most of those regions there. And it’s truly a paleo item. It’s really meat-based chili. It’s my favorite product so far that we’ve built out of all the jerkies and pre-made foods. It’s got chocolate, bourbon, all sorts of complex flavors in it. It’s the way that we make it is a really slow cook. So let’s all the flavors come out of it. And we’re really excited about people being able to try that.
Diana Rodgers, RD
So I was actually picturing something else that’s happening with you guys in September that you invited me out to like…
Jon Sepp
You’re talking about the wheel of pain.
Diana Rodgers, RD
I didn’t even know what the name of it. You just kind of like described like this, you know, opportunity for people…
Jon Sepp
I love that. You want to talk about my side projects, which have been a real sore subject because being on a limited budget, you can’t really spend time and money on other stuff you want to on a ranch. I will say I built this very cheap. But we built a giant device and I call it the wheel of pain. Just like Arnold Schwarzenegger is first movie, his first scene. If you remember Conan the Barbarian, he was chained to the wheel of pain from a boy to a man and he just had to push this giant millstone which was like this big log device to grind grain or whatever. And you know, for 20 years, and that was what made him Conan the Barbarian. I just for whatever reason we wanted to this. Let me back up. That gives you some context for the wheel of pain what that is. Last year I really wanted and have always wanted to fully cook an entire bison. I’ve been to powwows out here on the reservation where they dig a hole in the ground. I’ve seen that many times. I’ve seen people cook different, you know, like half a beef, quarter of a beef. But never have I seen somebody actually spit roast entire bison. And we came up with this idea to spit roasted entire bison, which is how the wheel of pain came about. As we were drinking beers, we said wouldn’t it be cool if instead of just having a big spit, it was turned by some kind of device. And then we said remember like that thing that like Conan has in his first movie, we should build one of those to turn it. And that turned into an even bigger idea. And we ended up building a replica of the wheel of pain for that movie. It’s massive, it’s huge. But you push this big long structure in a circle, and every six times around, it has a big gearing system that rotates an entire bison, that’s butterflied. And that over about 20 hours, you can cook a whole buffalo. So we’re doing a big event with that we have a lot of special guests coming out at that time. And yes, we plan on making that an annual or semi annual event. And I love the love that you’re talking about it because it’s totally made me feel vindicated that I spent a bunch of time to build this.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Yeah, and if you send me if you send me a little video, we can have Emily splice that into the YouTube version of this. So people, but there’s going to be an opportunity for people to visit your ranch and stay. You’re building some kind of like hospitality situation. And that’s going to be coming.
Jon Sepp
That’s right. We’re soft, launching that in September as well. So that will be…
Diana Rodgers, RD
That was really what I was trying to talk about and then you lit up about the wheel of pain.
Jon Sepp
Okay. We can talk about it all. That’s where my mind’s going.
Brittany Masters
I have an idea. And the next thing you know, this full blown replica is built in the middle of the pasture. And I’m like from idea to reality in a week.
Jon Sepp
But anyway, yes, we are also launching a full resort here on the ranch. So we’ll be able to host up to 24 people a day. We’ll have a regenerative restaurant that we’re building. We’re just breaking ground on that. And we’ve rebuilt a bunch of old homesteads on one of our ranches that were settled at the late 1800s, early 1900s. And we have torn them apart nail by nail, rebuilt them. They’re absolutely beautiful. We have a big reception center barn. We’ll have a fire lookout that people can stay in. That’s brand new at the top of the ranch. And the best part is, it’s not a dude ranch, where it’s actually an anti-dude ranch, people would be able to come and see what does it really take to build 200 miles of fence? What does it really take to move this many bison? What is a real regenerative ranch look like when it’s operating? How do you move your water? What are you looking at in your grass? How do you deal with all these different things and allowing the consumer to get up close to that, but also still be comfortable at the same time? So it’s a Costco experience. But for, you know, a resort.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Las Vegas ranch? Yeah. And so when does that launch? And is it going to be year-round or just seasonal?
Jon Sepp
We’ll take a pulse…
Brittany Masters
When does it launch?
Jon Sepp
It’s invite only this fall, but coming next spring, and anybody that like buys our product in the store, there’s a little QR code there you can see on the back, if you scan that QR code, you can possibly win a trip, preemptive trip to the ranch. We’ll be selecting a few consumers to just invite them to that experience before it’s open to the public this coming spring. So between June and July of 24, which is you know, a year from now, that’s when everybody will be able to come and enjoy it.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Yeah, well, I will be in Uruguay right when your event is happening. But I very much look forward to coming and maybe, you know doing, you know, a special workshop with you guys or something like that. Yeah. So that’s… what’s it going to be called?
Brittany Masters
The High Tail.
Jon Sepp
The High Tail.
Diana Rodgers, RD
The High Tail. Yeah. Awesome.
Brittany Masters
So you’ve heard that expression, hightail it out of here?
Diana Rodgers, RD
Yeah.
Jon Sepp
Which comes from bison.
Brittany Masters
Yeah.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Ah!
Jon Sepp
Yeah. So like settlers that were traveling across the west of bison’s tail, if it’s shaped kind of not just high, but also in a bit of an S. That would be you get a high tail sign – time to get out of here. Right. And so…
Brittany Masters
It’s going to be a sporty experience, is what we’re trying to say.
Jon Sepp
We’re not all massages and food. You know, there’s some difficult things in here that you’ll get to suffer with us. You know, okay,
Diana Rodgers, RD
Well, but will there be massages, though?
Jon Sepp
There will be massages. It’s not all bad. It’d be pretty fun.
Diana Rodgers, RD
I can’t wait. I’m really excited for that. Okay, so let’s briefly… I know you guys don’t probably don’t have a ton of time left, because you got to get back out. But I did want to kind of just talk about – you were talking about some of the sort of like, you know, it’s not just money that is one of the struggles, but there’s also like, you got to learn the lay of the social climate and deal with interesting people out there. So tell me what you feel comfortable sharing because I know way too much about this, but it’s just kind of a… it’s just a fascinating like, Who would have thunk that you would have to not only deal with you know like gulch, degraded land and all this stuff, but then this extra like bizarre layer of weirdness?
Jon Sepp
I could go on and on about all of the difficulties in all facets to include even food businesses, big ones, ones that are supported in the public eye and you find out that’s such a nasty business. There’s awful people in a lot of food businesses. Anyway, I’m not gonna plug on that. But I will say, yes, in the ranching business, it’s just the same, you know, each person has their own individual… there’s, I think, also like a misconception that every rancher is just salt of the earth and you know, completely just the best person. And where does that lead us in? To operate this to run this, I can’t always just afford to buy large swaths of land, I simply can’t. We’re not coming from a place of inheritance. We’re working into this as first generation and trying to achieve larger pieces of land to run… to reach economy of scale. And yes, one of the instances of – we’ve had lots of things go crazy from. I could get into it. But what you’re referring to specifically that I’m looking at out here was, we used to have a very large lease. And that lease, when we got it was just barren land. when we very first started, when Brittany very first moved out here, and she said, Don’t sell the land. Let’s see if we can grow this bigger. Let’s look for leases. Let’s see what we can do. We got offered what we felt like was a huge opportunity. So we got suckered again, we got dry-gulched by, of all things, a developing cult, here in Montana. And this was before the cults had arrived. They had just purchased a lot of land. And they asked us to fence all of it for them at an extremely discounted rate. But the promise we’re going to be there pretty much forever, we’re gonna get to run this, it will be, you know, a kind of a flagship that we’ll be able to really build a giant regenerative model. And we spent five years plus on the land building over 100 miles of fence. You were there.
Diana Rodgers, RD
That was a fencing that I probably maybe helped with, like two or three of the posts, I remember. Yeah.
Brittany Masters
So you got dry-gulched, too.
Jon Sepp
Yeah, you got. Yeah. And to build something like that is very hard to probably explain unless you’ve done that volume of fencing and particular on the… particularly on the budget. And where we were doing it. It’s not just flatland. It was all very mountain fence. And to do that volume, there are times Brittany and I for years worked, you know, 300 days straight without taking a break. And then we take a short break and go right back to it. But it really sucks your soul and body away to do that kind of work, that level of sacrifice can’t be conveyed to somebody to do it for that long. You lose years of your life. And anyway, we had built all this up because the opportunity felt exciting. We were going to give a part of ourselves to this land, to transform it into what would be an absolute regenerative model in the United States, the you know, Golden Rainbow that are the cream of the crop the top. And we did… it was amazing. For five years. And little did we know this cult that owned the land, which was not made aware to us, for where we were in early on, decided now we had finished the infrastructure, we did the hard work, they’re going to come in and pull the rug out from underneath us which they did. And man talk about our tough couple of years. We’ve been out of this now for three plus years. But that was a really difficult time to just lose that. They had an incredible amount of money, attorneys. There was no winning against this unless you had an equal amount of time and money, which we did not.
Brittany Masters
It was 2020. You know, it was like January of 2020 when that happens.
Jon Sepp
Yeah. And it was just a whole series of events, to having to find another piece of property, to find another lease close by – to the fence that in a record period of time after we had just finished what felt like a lifetime project. If you’ve given everything to do it. Then move the whole herd. It was a year or two of stress that took 10 years off my life, but definitely made me eyes wide open to any process moving forward in any of our businesses for Yeah, and was totally crazy in the process from our animals being killed, to threats, to I was just trying to hurry to make things happen. I got gored, I got trampled twice in the process, terribly injured, still recovering from that years ago. A lot of difficulty in this process. But yeah, that’s just a small slice of what it takes to bring all these products to market to continually be evolving and going through that and it sounds unique and difficult and like a lot of struggle, but I don’t think that’s just endemic to us. There’s a lot of people that are struggling through all those types of things as you try to grow. Right. This was just… it was a weird segue because of the cult aspects that we were made aware of later.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Yeah and I wish we could share with people a little bit more about because there’s probably a lot of people listening who would be familiar with the this one and be more fascinated. I mean the actual story. One day you’ll be able to explain more, I’m sure.
Jon Sepp
Oh yeah. We’ll write a book about it one day. We can talk about it then.
Brittany Masters
We’re not saying much right now.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Yeah. Yeah, just just wild. So where can people learn more about you? We’ve talked about you know, go to the Costco in those specific areas. But please share your your website, your Instagram, how to get on that waiting list to come visit you at this new cool place, High Tail.
Jon Sepp
you go to www.goroamfree.com and you sign up just for our newsletter. We’ll also be releasing stuff about the high tail and redirecting people when that launches, Instagram or Instagram is probably our most popular app – go roam free. We… people love to follow that. We have like an orphan bottle calf that lives in our house half the time. Her name is Oreo, The Adventures of Oreo you can watch the adventures of Oreo all day or watch us struggle on the mountain side or you know get attacked by the cult people. We’ve seen it all. It’s really exciting and fun. So if you like just entertaining, totally random bison ranching stories. That’s the place to go and watch.
Brittany Masters
Yeah. And you can find our stuff at Costco. You can find our smoke products in natural grocers and Sprouts in the Rocky Mountain and west coast areas. Yep. And yeah, we’re on Facebook too – go roam free.
Diana Rodgers, RD
And can people still get your jerky through your website? Or… Yeah, they can order your jerky. And the pizza flavor is really cool. You’ve got like a pizza flavor. You’ve got like a spicy Thai chili one.
Jon Sepp
Yep,
Brittany Masters
Moroccan Heat.
Jon Sepp
And we will be launching some other meat snack flavors also in most Costcos come September. So you’ll be able to get more unique difficult or different goods. They’re in a different section. They’re not ready to eat but jerky products as well.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Awesome.
Jon Sepp
Yeah.
Diana Rodgers, RD
So great. So great. Anything else you want to add? Before we go?
Jon Sepp
We loved seeing you again when you came out here for the festival. But I can’t wait to have you back out to the ranch and show you most recently what we’re doing. I’m serious about that. We’d love to have you again. Yeah, when you’re free. I know you’re busy. But when you’re free, we’d love to have you and Anson come back out, see what it looks like?
Diana Rodgers, RD
No, he just really loved you guys. And he even remembered the name of your dog who I can’t even remember the name of your dog. But he remembered it. What’s the dogs name?
Jon Sepp
Teddy.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Teddy. Yeah. And so he was really happy to see you guys when we were out in Montana. And I’m just so like, I feel like I am taking a little credit for your success only because I’ve been like watching you along and I’ve like been rooting for you on the sidelines this whole time. So…
Brittany Masters
I mean, 100% You’ve done a ton just for meat for ranchers or farmers. I mean, it’s imperative what you do too. So we appreciate the support. Yeah, it can be sometimes a dark corner being farmers and ranchers out there when you look at the media. So it’s really, really nice to have, you know, other people out there especially nutritionists supporting what we do and getting the truth out there. So…
Diana Rodgers, RD
Yeah, thank you. Well, much success as you move forward with all these new ventures and I am definitely out there as soon as I can make it out. So, looking foward to it.
Brittany Masters
All right,
Jon Sepp
I look forward to it.
Brittany Masters
Thanks, Diana.
Diana Rodgers, RD
Have a great afternoon.
Jon Sepp
You too. Bye
Diana Rodgers, RD
Thanks so much for listening today and for following my work. If you believe in making sure that people all over the world should have access to nutritious food, please join my mission through my non-profit, the Global Food Justice Alliance. Visit sustainabledish.com/join and become a sustaining member today. All sustaining members get early access to ad-free podcasts plus free downloads, and you’ll be helping get healthy protein like meat, fish, and eggs to food-insecure kids. That’s sustainabledish.com/join. And thank you.
